Episode 174: Kelsie Rutherford
Former Regulatory Counsel at SES Satellites; now Attorney Advisor at FCC, Multilateral and Regional Affairs Branch, Office of International Affairs
00:51:10
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Show Notes
As part of our series featuring leading women in space law, Kelsie Rutherford, at the time of this interview Regulatory Counsel at SES, a global satellite operator, shares her journey to an in-house role and her leadership in space policy through her industry representation at the ITU's World Radiocommunication Conference in Dubai. Kelsie shares what it takes to break into the space industry and what makes an effective in-house counsel. Join in as she takes us into her unique career journey, offering us an insight into what’s in store for those brave enough to give this nascent industry a try. Tune in!
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About Kelsie Rutherford:
Kelsie Rutherford previously served as Regulatory Counsel for SES, a global satellite operator, where she led regulatory initiatives spanning satellite and telecommunication sectors across international jurisdictions. Kelsie worked with stakeholders worldwide to find win-win solutions that integrate emerging technologies into regulatory frameworks and expand communication ecosystems globally.
Kelsie's other interests include attending live theater performances and concerts, supporting the Tennessee Volunteers, playing golf, and traveling. She holds a J.D. from The Catholic University of America Columbus School of Law and an undergraduate degree in Journalism and Electronic Media from the University of Tennessee. Kelsie is a member of the Space & Satellite Professionals International Mid-Atlantic Chapter Board of Directors.
Transcript
In this episode, I'm very pleased to have join us, Kelsie Rutherford. [At the time of this interview] She's a Regulatory Counsel at SES Satellites. She is an amazing and inspiring in-house counsel. Welcome, Kelsie.
MC, thank you so much for having me. It's great to be here with you.
Thank you so much for joining and talking about your journey. I think there are so many interesting things about your path in the law, including making your way in an emerging part of the law. Also, I want to talk about some of your recent international work, which is interesting too. First, I wanted to generally get a sense of what made you decide to go to law school and what interested you about being a lawyer to begin with.
Kelsie Rutherford’s Journey To Being A Lawyer
It started with me wanting to be a journalist. More specifically, my dream was to be an international field reporter. I wanted to travel to different countries, report news, and relay information about different people and cultures all across the world. I majored in Journalism Electronic Media in undergrad and I think it was my sophomore year of college that I needed to take a political science class as part of my required classes.
I signed up for what I thought was just a regular political science class, but the class was taught by a retired lawyer and he ran his class like a first-year law class. I remember the first class because he was cold-calling on people in this class. I went to the University of Tennessee, which is a pretty big school, and I was used to professors lecturing at you, but he was cold calling on people and asking them to answer questions about the assigned reading.
I was sitting there thinking, “Where am I? What kind of class is this? How did I end up here?” I had such stage fright so I was just thinking, “Please don't call on me.” In the end, I loved it. I thought it was so interesting the way he challenged us and the kind of conversations we had during class. I loved it. I started thinking, “Maybe I should go to law school.”
I knew that several journalists and news analysts had law degrees so I decided maybe I should go get a law degree because this would enable me to be an even better journalist and hopefully, help me with my career. My mom is a lawyer so the idea was always in the back of my head and she was very excited when I told her I was going to law school. That's how it all got started.
It is interesting how something like that completely off the radar gets you interested in that. It's like the Socratic Method, the critical thinking, and all of it that you said, “This is interesting.”
Exactly, and it was interesting too because when I started law school, I had no idea what I wanted to do with my law degree. I just knew that I wanted to work in the communications field and I wanted a law degree to help open more career doors for me. This might put me in a practicing communications law firm or in-house or maybe it would result in me using my law degree to help me be a better journalist.
I truly didn't know what my career had in store for me but I think that’s one of the beauties of going through law school is that as you develop a deeper understanding of how the law works through your classes, you learn how the law is applied in different ways through your internships and your clerkships. Both of those things paired with the guidance that you receive from mentors and your professors all eventually click.
One of the beauties of going through law school is that as you develop a deeper understanding of how the law works through your classes, you learn how the laws applied in different ways through your internships and your clerkships.
That's how you start to figure out what your options are and what you might want to do with your degree. It was great. That's what happened to me. During my first year of law school, I was having a conversation with an alumni at a networking event. I was explaining my situation to them and this person recommended that I apply for a summer internship at the Federal Communications Commission or the FCC. That summer after 1L year, I got an internship at the Media Bureau Policy Division at the FCC.
Honestly, that experience, that internship is what jumpstarted my career as a telecommunications lawyer and solidified that this is the field I want to work in specifically. I was very interested in telecommunications law. In particular for me as a Journalism Electronic Media major, that internship was so fulfilling in so many ways because I saw the circle become complete. I'd spent four years in undergrad learning about the broader communications industry.
Through my journalism classes, I learned not only how to communicate news and stories to people, but also about the technologies that are used to transmit various communications to people across the world. This internship was the first place where I was exposed to the policies and the regulations that enable these communications and shape the industry, pave paths for new communications technologies to be used to connect people across the US and across the globe. That's how it all got started.
I was going to say, looking back, it often always makes sense. Looking back you're like, “When we put all the bricks together, the path is clear,” but when you're on the path getting there, you're like, “I don't know where to go next. I don't know how this all fits together,” but just knowing about your undergrad and then what kind of work you're doing now, it's like, “Yeah, the methods of communication,” that's what you're involved with enabling and that's neat given your original journalists. After law school and having that internship, did you say, “I'm going to go into the practice of law instead of journalism,” or did you keep that open?
No. It was after that internship that I was like, “This is what I want to do. I want to be in telecommunications law.” I knew I wanted to be in regulatory and then I feel like each internship experience I had even solidified that more. After that first internship in the Media Bureau of Policy Division, I stayed in the FCC and interned in former FCC Commissioner Mignon Clyburn's office, which I absolutely loved. It was such an amazing experience because, in the Media Bureau Policy Division, I was focused on very specific topics, but in the Commissioner's Office, they touch on everything that is happening throughout the FCC.
It was such a great experience. In particular, interestingly, Commissioner Clyburn's office was very focused on rural broadband connectivity. Making sure everyone had connectivity in all four corners of the US. Interestingly, that has become a huge part of my current role at SES since satellites are a huge part of rural connectivity. That experience was such an important building block for me in my career. Also, it set me up to help me in my other internships throughout law school. I was at Ligado Networks, which is a satellite company as well and then I ended up at SES. It's all been great.
Also, the experiences and the particular policies and regulations where you were at for the internships we're working on also nudged or influenced where the rest of your opportunities were or where you wanted to go next.
It's funny how everything interweaves with each other and every opportunity I've had, and every internship experience I've had set me up to succeed in my current role at SES as a satellite regulatory attorney. It's been great how it's all worked out, for sure.
Breaking Down The In-House Regulatory Attorney Role
Can you break it down a little bit? When you say regulatory attorney, what kinds of things are you doing? I would say now from the in-house position, what does that look like?
One of the great things about being an in-house regulatory attorney is that it is extremely dynamic and you get to work with a bunch of different people on a wide variety of topics, both internally and externally. From an internal perspective, I think the best way to illustrate this is through an example. Let’s say it has been decided that SES wants to relocate one of our geostationary satellites from one orbital location to another.
One of the great things about being an in-house regulatory attorney is that it is extremely dynamic.
To break it down, geostationary satellites are the furthest away from Earth. You've got low earth orbit satellites, which are the closest at an altitude of about 160 to 2,000 kilometers in space above the Earth and then you have medium earth orbit, which is in the middle. You then have geostationary satellites, which operate at an altitude of 35,786 kilometers away from Earth. They're the furthest out.
All of our geostationary satellites are authorized to provide services from a very specific spot in space, and this is called your orbital location. These are assigned to you. From there, these geostationary satellites provide connectivity services to a wide area on Earth. Some of our geostationary satellites, for example, have beams that cover almost all of North America.
Also, because these orbital locations are assigned to you when you obtain your authority from a regulator like the FCC for example, you have to ask for new authority when you want to move your satellite to a different orbital location. You can't just move your satellites around willy-nilly wherever you want.
It makes a lot of sense because there are a lot of satellites out there so you need to make sure.
For satellite operators with a geostationary fleet, it is quite common to relocate satellites among your various orbital locations and there are various reasons for this. One reason might be because we need to retire a satellite so we move one of our other geostationary satellites to that location to continue the connectivity. Also, it might be because we need additional capacity from that orbital location. There are various reasons for this.
It is truly incredible the number of people and teams that I work with from the planning stages of a satellite relocation to the final relocation procedure. I work with our spacecraft fleet and ground teams to understand the relocation plans. It means the proposed new location, the timing, which earth stations we need to use to move our satellites, and also, which earth stations will be used to provide the new service from the new location.
I need to speak with our spectrum engineers to make sure all the proposed plans don't violate any current coordination agreements we have. Also, I need to speak with them if there are any issues with the proposed frequency bands that we want to use and any other spectrum policy issues more generally. I also need to have conversations with our sales teams to make sure I understand the business reasons behind the proposed move because that is something I'll definitely need to relay to the regulator.
Sometimes I also need to speak with the contracts lawyers to make sure that the proposed relocation doesn't violate any current customer agreements that we have. In between all of these conversations, I'm doing my own research and analysis to understand the regulatory requirements and to make sure I fully understand the rules and regulations that we need to follow. Also, make sure that everything complies with the rules.
Sometimes they do, but other times they don't. If they don't, then my goal is to find a way forward so we are still able to do the proposed relocation. This always involves communication with the regulator like the FCC to understand whether a waiver of the rules is possible or whether there are some other regulatory procedures that we can take. This is just one example of a project and in that one project, I'm working with people in different countries and teams. It's so fun to work in such a dynamic way. Also, because of these conversations and projects that I work on, I feel like I have a very robust understanding of how the company works.
That's what I was going to say. That's one of the things that's positive because as you were relaying it, I was thinking you're not talking to a lot of other lawyers in that regard. You're talking to people doing a lot of other things within the company and in gaining that understanding to talk to the regulators, you have a larger understanding of what's going on in the company itself.
When you're speaking to other lawyers, that's one conversation but it is so different when you're speaking to salespeople or business people or people on your finance team or engineers. We all speak our own business language. Being able to interact with these different teams and communicate in an effective and efficient way is so important to make sure that everyone's on the same page and we all understand what's happening and that kind of thing. That's a super big benefit also to being able to work in that kind of environment.
That's part of being a strong in-house lawyer too, is gaining that understanding within the company and communicating across different types of folks within the company who might need your help to communicate with each other, in fact.
As you build these relationships within the company, when they have questions or issues, they also know that they can come to you and that builds that relationship and trust, which is always super important. There are so many great things about my job and being a regulatory attorney in the telecommunications industry is so exciting. One of the cool things actually that I love is the constant influx of disruptive technologies and services that are entering the market.
I love the challenge of putting the puzzle pieces together of how these new markets impact entrants and impact us, how they impact the satellite industry as a whole, and whether there are even regulations that govern these new technologies and services. Also, having to figure out, “How can we operate in a way that gets us to the win-win solution?”
How can we all work together to be able to still provide our services but still welcome a new entrance into the market? As these new services and technologies enter the market, be it from my company or other stakeholders, it's super important also as a regulatory attorney to have a grasp of the current regulations and policies both in the US and other countries. It’s because SES is a global operator and it is important to understand how these new services fit within the current rules and regulations. Also, sometimes it's not such a neat fit. It's fitting a square peg into a round hole situation and sometimes there's simply no regulation that fits at all.
I was going to say, “There's also this scenario when we have the technology and the disruption is ahead of the regulation and what do you do in that circumstance,” but it's interesting.
It is and that to me is where the fund begins because that's where you get to start the challenging advocacy piece. That's when the regulatory attorney comes into play for me. It’s because if you are pushing for your company to be able to provide a new technology or service in a country where there's no current regulation that would enable that service, then you start reaching out to those regulators. You develop those relationships with the regulators and have those conversations.
You are trying to demonstrate how and why your service would be a great addition to their country and how it would enable or how it would operate alongside other operations and services without causing issues for them as well. Also, there's always the flip side. Let’s say it’s you're a company that's been providing services somewhere or a company that's been providing services in the country for several years, and you have established customers who rely heavily on those service services that you provide.
You then hear about new technologies and services that are coming to the market, but you have serious concerns about how their new operations could impact your current operations and services. You then need to play defense and work with the regulators and then also, the new operators ideally to find a way that everyone is happy. Current services are not impacted, but the new services can move forward with providing their new services to customers because no one wants to ever be the cause of stifling innovation unnecessarily.
No one wants to ever be the cause of stifling innovation unnecessarily.
We all want to work together, we all want there to be advances in technologies and services because it benefits everybody. Advocacy takes place at all stages of my job. Even when I'm preparing and filing an earth station application or a space station application, you're building a case putting forward your best arguments for why the regulator should grant your license to allow you to operate that technology or service. Advocacy flows through you at all stages and it's such an exciting, exciting thing to be part of.
It's a big-picture view of things because you're not just looking at the one item that you want to pass through regulatory muster, but also the bigger picture of where the regulations need to be developed or are developing. Also, how you gain that trust across the agencies to make sure that when you come in the next time, people will look at you a certain way and not a way you don't want them to.
I know at SES, whenever we have a new satellite that we want to launch or a new type of service that we want to provide, we always try to make an effort to go into the regulator and give them a heads up. We talk to them about it, get their concerns, and try to address any concerns that they might have. Also, I think that makes for a more efficient application process or consultation process.
The more discussions that are had, the more people at the table, and the more compromises that can be made between various parties. It enables more win-win solutions in the end and also, more efficient processes. Having those conversations with regulators within your industry groups or with other operators is always beneficial.
An Unusual Career Path To A Rapidly Growing Industry
I have to say this because it's very unusual for a lawyer or for a law student to graduate and go into an in-house opportunity right away. I wanted to talk about that a little bit. That's an unusual route and something that people might not have considered. They think, “I have to practice in a firm for a long time before I could consider being in-house with a company,” but that's not always true. There are different paths too.
Absolutely. I remember when I was in law school, several people said that whether it was on panels or in networking conversations. They had mentioned, “Yeah. It's very challenging to go straight into a company from law school. Usually, companies like to see you with law firm experience or government experience first.” That wasn't the case for me. I was interning at SES in my second semester of 3L year.
I was an intern and I loved working at SES. I loved the team. I felt like the team and I got along well. I showed up. I tried to impress as much as possible. I did really good work. I took the bar exam over the summer and didn't have anything lined up immediately but I was reaching out to people constantly trying to poke people I had either worked with in the past through my internships, speaking with my law school professors, and I reached out to SES.
I was like, “I loved working with you all. Is there an opportunity even for me to come back as an intern? I would even take an unpaid internship. I want to work with you all again.” It just so happened that interestingly they were starting up this new project called the C-Band Project and they needed some extra set of hands. I was brought on as a consultant in September 2018. A few months after I graduated, I started as a consultant. I was not even doing legal work. I was supporting the C-Band Project. I was reaching out to C-band broadcasters throughout the US asking if they needed help with applying for their waivers or registration or what have you. I was working with the broadcasters.
One of the regulatory councils at that time left and the position became available. I was there. It all worked out. That's how it happened. That was my story. I do know that a lot of people in the satellite industry in particular have started at companies right out of law school. I don't know if it's a unique quality that the satellite industry has, but the satellite industry, especially right now, is moving so quickly.
There are so many new technologies and services that are coming online and companies need the manpower. They need the young energy that a lot of recent grads have. I think it just often works out that companies in the satellite industry hire recent law school graduates. That's how it worked for me. I know it's the case for other people as well but it is interesting though. I wonder if it's the case in other industries where they're a little bit more hesitant to hire recent graduates.
I'm not sure but that is certainly something I was told as well in law school that it's very difficult to go straight in-house. All I can say is if you're interning at a company if you work hard, if you're energetic, if you show that you're passionate and interested, and try to have a great relationship with your supervisor and other people on the team, that goes a long way. It certainly did for me.
That's good advice to do good work in whatever role you have. I was wondering about that too, and the satellite area and other areas where it's fast developing. I think like one of the previous guests on the show who's now in the Arkansas Supreme Court talked about when she graduated from law school, the medical privacy laws, HIPAA, and all of that were just coming out and nobody knew anything about them. She learned everything there was to know about HIPAA and ended up being an expert in that.
She said it was an opportunity because there wasn't any. She didn't have competition against people who were twenty years out doing twenty years of HIPAA. There was no HIPAA. Nobody knew anything about it, but then she became knowledgeable about it. It seems like in industries where there's entropy legally or things are moving quickly in the technology, which then means the law needs to adopt as well. It's not like you can say, “We want an in-house lawyer with twenty years of experience doing exactly this somewhere else there. There isn't anyone like that. There are opportunities in those gaps or voids where things are moving fast for opportunities that wouldn't be in other industries or other places.
That's a great point. I also think whenever you're working in an industry like the satellite industry, the tech industry more broadly, or the telecom industry, being able to be creative and understanding that there's going to constantly be new technologies that don't fit in the square hole or the round hole. Being able to use the tools that you have in your toolbox, think outside the box, be comfortable with uncertainty, be very comfortable in gray areas, and understand how to navigate very uncertain situations that will take you a long way, especially in these industries.
Being able to use the tools that you have in your toolbox, think outside the box, and be comfortable with uncertainty will take you a long way, especially in rapidly growing industries.
I recalled that it resonated with me about what she had said. This whole concept of being in new spaces is having different kinds of opportunities. Also, to be aware of them and to be open to them.
Yes, absolutely. I love that. That's great.
I thought it was a great story from her and I was like, “Yeah, that's right. Nobody else knows any more than you if they have twenty years' experience or two years' experience. Nobody knows how this is going to play out, but you can become the expert and move forward from there.” I did want to mention that because this is unusual and it's completely counter to most career panels or advice that you hear like, “You have to do this first then that.” It's good to mention that.
Also, current law students shouldn't be discouraged by that. Whenever you hear someone say, “It's probably not going to happen.” Make it happen. Take that as a challenge. Don't ever let someone else build up your own limitations. Never be afraid to challenge the “status quo.” I know that's quite a common thing, but it's true. Don't be afraid of norms or what everyone's telling you. If you want to be in-house and that's truly a dream and that's something that you want to do, there are certainly ways to make it happen.
Whenever you hear someone say it's probably not going to happen, make it happen. Take that as a challenge. So don't ever let someone else build up your own limitations.
Honestly, I'll never forget too one of the reasons why they say it's good to go to a firm or a government agency first is because that's where you get true legal training, which I don't disagree with. I know you get great legal training on how to be a great attorney in both of those places but the training and the experiences that I've gotten working in-house are unparalleled.
I've gotten to see how different teams and companies work. I understand the relationships between companies, governments, regulators, companies, and law firms. They all work together. I wouldn't let that discourage you either if someone tells you, “You should probably go to do this because it'll be better for your career in the long run.” Use every opportunity as a way to benefit your career in the long run. I think there's no right path. I know for sure.
As I've said, working at SES has been such an amazing opportunity and the attorneys that we have on our team are fantastic. They are true experts in the telecom and satellite industry. I have learned so much from them. They've trained me and I'm the attorney I am now because of them. Between all of their expertise, we have all of the experts that we could need on one team. I think that's something definitely to keep in mind as well that there's no correct path forward.
A Unique Experience At The World Radio Conference
It's good to know what typically happens so you can see one pathway, but it doesn't mean it's the only pathway. I like your attitude about that too. You're like, “Okay. That's one way. It doesn't foreclose another way.” Tell me about your trip to Dubai and the role that you had there. Can you tell us a little bit about that?
I was at the World Radio Conference or the WRC. It was such an incredible opportunity and a wonderful experience. The World Radio Conference took place in Dubai. Let me back up a little bit. There's an international treaty called the Radio Regulations. The Radio Regulations define how a spectrum is to be operated and used by all users. Basically, it's how users of spectrum are allowed to send signals to provide their services to customers.
The Radio Regulations is managed under the United Nations umbrella and supported by the ITU or the International Telecommunications Union, which is the United Nations Agency for Information and Communications Technologies. We have the WRC, which takes place every four years and it is at the WRC where it's decided what updates and changes are needed to these international radio regulations based on new technologies and new services that have been rolled out or will be rolled out in the near future. The WRC is four weeks of basically 24/7 work, discussions, and negotiations. I think it's about 4,000 delegates representing 193 member states and more than 200 private companies have intense and lengthy debates on how to update these international regulations.
It's so unique in that regard because the companies and the industry have a voice at that point, which usually is not the case. You're talking about governments and agencies talking about it amongst themselves without that kind of direct input. It's a cool and interesting unique approach that the organization has.
The way it works is it's typically the countries who have the sway. They're the ones who come together and decide how the radio regulations are going to be updated but the companies within the member states delegations are able to try to influence the delegations to take certain positions. The companies play an important role and they're the voice of the industry. It's great that they're able to be involved in the delegations and to have a voice.
Also, about the practical implications of things. We were thinking about some rule and maybe the thought is this would be the outcome of that rule, but the industry would say, “The way it works, it wouldn't be that way.”
Exactly. It was great because I was lucky enough to be on a delegation at the World Radio Conference. I was on the United Kingdom delegation and it was such a wonderful experience because my responsibility was I was representing the United Kingdom at the World Radio Conference, but I was representing SES within the United Kingdom delegation. Whenever there were questions or new issues that came up throughout the four weeks, the United Kingdom came into the World Radio Conference knowing basically what their positions were going to be on the various agenda items.
However, as you can imagine things can change based on the negotiations that are happening over the course of the four weeks. As those things were changing, the United Kingdom delegation might come together and say, “What are the industry's thoughts on this new question that we have?” Being able to be the voice of SES and those conversations within the United Kingdom was such an amazing opportunity.
Also, having those kinds of discussions both with other industry participants and stakeholders in the United Kingdom delegation, but also with Ofcom who's the regulator. They represent the United Kingdom on the floor, take the mic and everything. Having conversations with them as well was such an incredible opportunity. As you can imagine, it's not super easy because updating the radio regulations must be done on consensus. Delegates need to agree on each and every update to the rules. As you can imagine, that's not super easy.
Having these group discussions within your delegation is extremely important because it keeps everyone updated on what's happening. It enables you to be able to provide the best kind of input and help the delegations be able to make the best recommendations based on what's happening. If you think about it, the WRC is like the Telecom Olympics because it happens every four years and it's not just satellite. It's the entire telecommunications and communications industry. People conduct studies, attend meetings, and prepare over the course of four years. For four weeks at the WRC, that's when all of this comes together. It was a wonderful experience.
It seems like that's a very unique opportunity for an in-house lawyer to be able to do. Also, at your stage of being an in-house lawyer, it's a cool opportunity. I'm so glad you got to have it and contributed and you will continue to do. I think it shows the depth and breadth of the role that you have as a regulatory counsel but also as your career is developing. It's exciting.
Thank you, MC.
Kelsie Rutherford’s Advice For Aspiring In-House Lawyers
What kind of advice would you give? You've given some advice in terms of how people can think about if you want to go in-house earlier than most people would say what you should do for that. However, what about telecom, your industry, or anything else that you might think law students should know in terms of career development, mentoring, or anything like that?
I think my biggest piece of advice is to take advantage of your internships and externships and try to get as much as you possibly can out of those experiences. It’s because having on your resume that you've worked somewhere and you've applied what you're learning in your law classes to a work setting is incredibly valuable for people who are hiring law students.
Also, this might sound like common sense, but try to shine in your internship. Have enthusiasm, show you’re interested in the projects that you're working on and that you want to learn, and show up on time. Stay late if you have to and don't complain. I think it’s those little things because I think for the most part, all interns want to do great at their work and they do great at their work. However, finding ways to go above and beyond to show “I love working here. I want to work with you. This is something I'm very passionate about,” goes a long way.
Being the first to raise your hand for volunteering on projects and asking questions. Always ask questions. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Supervisors love to answer questions. I have interns and I love it when they come to me with questions because it shows that they're thinking about it. They're interested in what they're working on. Also, it gives me an opportunity as well to converse with them and hopefully, help them move forward and advance their skillsets and everything. I think that the biggest piece of advice I have is to find a way to shine and take advantage of those internships and externships.
That's good advice because I think sometimes people can think it's just an internship or it's just this. Even if it's not an internship that leads directly to a full-time position somewhere, it's important in your training. Also, as your example shows, down the road, you could boomerang back. You never know.
Exactly or they could be a great recommendation for you.
They might know somewhere else they could.
“I know someone who is hiring and you would be great.” They can recommend you, especially in this industry because it's telecom, it's a pretty small world. Being in the right place at the right time is oftentimes how things work out. Being sure to network and get to know people. One thing I also always tell law students is when you attend a panel, certainly, you should try to attend as many panels or lunch and learn as you can. Joining the Federal Communications Bar Association as a student for sure but when you attend these panels and lunch and learns, follow up with the panelists afterwards.
Usually, they provide the contact information of the panelists and if one of the panelists or speakers seems interesting or you want to have further discussions with them, absolutely reach out to them. Say, “I've attended this and loved it. I'd love to speak with you more about it. Would you like to grab a coffee sometime?” First of all, it shows that you are very interested and you're proactive and that's an honor. That's extremely flattering as well for the person who is speaking. Do things like that as well.
That's a good suggestion to follow up with people that resonate with you or that you say, “I think I'd get along with that person,” or to follow up on the opportunities that you do have. You’re a pretty good mentor there. That's good advice. What do you think about your role as in-house counsel? The things that maybe you didn't recognize were part of that role before you became regulatory counsel? Is there something that was the biggest surprise to you being in-house?
The Biggest Surprise
I don't know if it was necessarily a surprise for me, but one thing that's certainly been great about being in-house is the wide variety of projects that you get to work on. When I first started, I was like, “I'm going to work in satellite and telecom regulatory law,” but it's more than just that. The number of projects I've gotten to work on is incredible. For example, whenever a merger acquisition project comes up, I get to join that.
It's still regulatory law, but it's an entirely different part of the regulatory world. You're dealing with different government agencies and different regulators. In my case, especially internally, you're dealing with a whole different team of people that I don't deal with. We have a market analyst team. I don't cross paths with them that often in my day-to-day but whenever there are merger and acquisition projects that arise, which sometimes they do, I get to work with them, which is incredible. I learn so much about their area as well. I think those opportunities in-house that you don't necessarily get in other places because you're very focused on very specific areas of the law is cool. I love that about working in-house.
You have to solve problems and the problems come in a lot of different ways.
Also, working in-house, you never know what your day is going to bring. You might come to work with a checklist of things that you want to get done. I do that and that usually never happens because so many things come up throughout the day and you never know who's going to message you on Teams or whatever messaging system you use with questions or something like that. It’s certainly very exciting.
Also, the kind of related news this, but not necessarily to the extent maybe that it is, it’s how international satellite work is, especially SES. We have two satellite systems. We have our geostationary systems and then we have our non-geostationary system, which is our Medium Earth Orbit satellite system. We have geostationary satellites that cover the entire globe and then our non-geostationary satellite is inherently international in the way that it operates.
It's amazing the opportunities to be able to support and lead projects in other parts of the country and also, the world. For example, one initiative we're leading is finding how to get ESIMs or Earth Stations In Motion being authorized for ESIMs in various countries. That's something that I've been able to work on while I've been at SES.
It's been such an incredible experience because as you see in dealing with trying to get authorizations in different countries, different regions often have very different ways of licensing satellites and licensing earth stations. It's such an incredible opportunity to be able to work on those different projects and understand, “This is how you have to get a license in the US but this is how you have to get a license in the Netherlands. This is how you do it in Nigeria.”
It’s the whole comparative thing.
I love those experiences and those projects where I get to go trans-border, do international work and work with people from across the globe. I think that's such an incredible way to learn and it broadens your understanding as well of the regulations that you're familiar with too. I primarily work in the US and Canada, but as I've gotten to work on licensing and consultations in other regions and countries, it helps me understand the laws and regulations of the US way more and think about them from a totally different perspective. “We do this in the US but this is how they do this in the Netherlands. Why is that? Why are there these differences?” It gets you to ask more questions and think more robustly about all aspects of your job. I love that part as well.
Lightning Round With Kelsie Rutherford
The comparative thing does have you think because you think, “There's not just one way to do this. There's a lot of different ways and why,” as you said, which is more effective for different purposes. Also, it gets you out of that sense. When you're just in one way of operating, you think, “This is how it's done,” but you're like, “No. There are all these other ways to do it.” Also, to get new insight into the laws you're regularly dealing with as a result of that. It's neat to pull back and see that. Lightning round questions. The first question is, what would be your top tip to outside counsel working with in-house counsel?
My top tip is to know that you're going to get all kinds of crazy scenarios and questions, which I'm sure they already know but be prepared for those crazy scenarios and questions that your client will come to you with.
Stay open and be creative. Which talent would you most like to have but don't?
I would love to be a better public speaker. That's something that I would like to focus on and practice more. It doesn't come supernaturally to me, hence, why I had such a bright of being cold called on during that first class. That's something I would love to work on.
It's an important skill. I would say you're a very good speaker already. Who are some of your favorite writers?
My favorite author is Barbara Kingsolver. She is my favorite author. I love everything that she writes. First of all, the vocabulary that she uses and the way that she creates stories and is able to pull you in are magical almost. Also, the way she can transport you from where your current situation to a totally different world is amazing. I love her ability to transfix you with her writing.
She does have a unique talent and skill in that regard. Who is your hero in real life?
My mom, for sure. Whenever I have questions, she's the source of all of the wisdom. We have a very special connection and relationship. Also, always having her give me very honest advice and feedback but always being there in a very supportive way as well is wonderful. It’s definitely my mom.
It's nice when you have that kind of relationship with either parent but with your mom in particular. I think is special. For what in life do you feel most grateful?
There's so many on that one. I think I'm most grateful for probably my husband and the support that he gives me. We met during orientation week of undergrad and he stuck it through law school with me. He is my best friend. I'm just so grateful to have such a supportive partner in him.
Given the choice of anyone in the world and they can be with us or not with us, who would you invite to a dinner party? It could be more than one person.
It would be Jackie Onassis. I would love to talk to Jackie O or Jackie Kennedy about her life. She is such an interesting person. She is so intelligent, worldly, charismatic, and fashionable. I think she'd be such an incredible person to speak with. Also, I feel like I speak with her because I listen to her podcast, but I think it'd be fun to talk to Hillary Clinton as well. I think she's a really interesting person. She is very intelligent. She is been through so much. She's lived through it all and she's been very successful in politics, but also, had some interesting situations. I think those two would be interesting to speak with.
What an interesting combination too. Individually, it certainly equates the dramatic lives, but together that would be a whole other meta-level of the two of them. The last question is what is your motto, if you have one?
Everything happens for a reason. That is my motto. It's gotten me through so much. It's a security blanket because I know whenever things are going sideways or I'm in a very challenging situation or I feel down, I think, “Everything happens for a reason.” Also, I know that I'm going through this situation or I'm being faced with this challenge and it's only going to make me stronger. It's only going to enable me to handle similar situations or even more challenging situations in the future down the road. That's my motto that I go by.
It can help you to sort of keep moving forward and look for the light if things are dark. There's got to be something good that can come from this kind of thing. I think that's a great way to end. Thank you so much, Kelsie, for joining the show and sharing your thoughts about your journey, but also, about how others can excel in their careers and take the most of the opportunities they have. I appreciate your insights and for joining.
Thank you, MC. It was great to be here. It's such an honor to join your show and I loved our conversation.
Thank you, Kelsie. Have a great day.
You too.